Making $378K per Year as a Fiverr Freelancer With Alex Fasulo

Freelance To Freedom

Kristin:    00:00:00    Do you want to earn an online income or start a side hustle but have no idea where to start or don't know what skills you have that will translate to making money online? My online course, Freelance To Freedom, provides a step-by-step system to help you create unlimited time and location freedom using the skill set you already have. This course is for you. If you have some work experience and you want to be able to start earning an online income as a freelancer consultant or offering professional services, you can sign up today and take the course at your own pace at digitalnomadbootcamp.com or by going to the link in the show notes. Check it out at digitalnomadbootcamp.com. 

Introduction: Welcome to Badass Digital Nomads, where we're pushing the boundaries of remote work and travel, all while staying grounded with a little bit of old school philosophy, self-development, and business advice from our guests. 

Kristin Wilson, host:    00:01:14    Hey there, Kristin, from Traveling with Kristin here and welcome to episode 180 of Badass Digital Nomads. My guest today is the lovely Alexandra Fasulo who is a part-time digital nomad, a full-time entrepreneur extraordinaire and an inspiration to her nearly 1 million followers on social media. Alex is a remote work thought leader, a CNBC contributor, and author of the upcoming book, Freelance to Freedom, How to Free Yourself From the Corporate World and Build the Life of Your Dreams. Alex's new book Hits stores on November 15th and it's available to pre-order now, so make sure to check it out. I first came across Alex's story through a CNBC video on their YouTube channel, make It, and then later that year I had the pleasure of hosting a panel that she participated in the Digital Nomad Summit of 2021 on the podcast today we're going back to the very beginning as I aim to uncover exactly how her first steps looked when she was getting into the freelancing game and what she's learned about how to be a successful freelancer over the past seven years.  

Kristin:    00:02:34    In the lightning round, she shares some of the top mistakes that she sees new freelancers making and setting up their online profiles and also the tools she uses most often to run her freelancing business. Before we get started though, I just wanted to thank you for the very kind and thoughtful comments that you left on my YouTube video about Why I left the United States and also in my post in the Facebook group in the Badass Digital Nomads Group and also that I have received as Instagram dms and also over email. It's really been so heartwarming and overwhelming in the best way to reconnect with so many of you and including people who have never commented on my videos before. My sister actually sent me a text message and she was like, your community is so amazing <laugh>. She said, your subscribers post such thoughtful comments on your YouTube channel and the vast majority are super nice.  

Kristin:    00:03:41    It's also so cool how they share their personal stories and I completely agree there's so much negativity on the internet, but there's zero <laugh> in in our community and so I'm just so proud of the high quality of exceptional people from around the world that have come together around my content. It's hard to comprehend and put into words and even since I've gotten to Portugal, I've had listeners of the podcast and subscribers reach out to me even over text message and some of the Portugal WhatsApp groups that I'm in. Shout out to Leah who said that she started working on her dual citizenship in Portugal. After listening to the podcast, she made a lot of life changes, ended a long-term relationship and has been living in Portugal since March. She said she loves it and she has no regrets whatsoever, but she still remembers the Covid days being back home in Tennessee and laying in bed in the middle of the afternoon listening to the podcast which she somehow randomly discovered and feeling a sense of hope that there's more out there for her, that it's possible to live a location independent lifestyle and that it's worth it and that she's not alone.  

Kristin:    00:05:15    Also, as I mentioned last week, I'll start posting threads about each podcast episode in the Facebook group so that we can have a conversation about each topic. And this week Larry responded about leaving the US and he said that he has similar reactions to the constant mindless holiday marketing in America, although this is infecting other countries to some extent and I agree with that. He says at least Western countries such as Canada and the UK, but between the cost of living, the political tension and the overall cultural atmosphere in the US, he's definitely looking into long-term alternative places to live. And over on the YouTube front, Maria said, how many times could I like this video from a former expat about to be an expat again in 2023? Travel on. The unbounded journey also said, I'm glad we're not the only ones who have struggled with this decision to leave the US in the last couple of years.  

Kristin:    00:06:21    We should be heading out in a few weeks and are so ready to get back to full-time travel. Also thanks to Paul Mustang and Araise here in Portugal who both tagged me on Facebook and Instagram respectively with their copies of Digital Nomads for Dummies. So if you have a copy of Digital Nomads for Dummies, make sure to take a photo and tag me at Traveling with Kristin on social media. Someone had taken a photo at a campsite where they were living their van life and it's just been so cool to see where you are all reading your books from. Paul was reading his paper copy from a coffee shop in Vilna Lithuania while Jeff and Deanna my Patreon patrons have their e-book with them, which they have been referencing on their Kindle from their current home base of Albania and they are headed to Greece soon.  

Kristin:    00:07:21    So packing light, I like it guys. Two other announcements before we jump into today's episode. The Expat Money Summit has started yesterday November 7th and that is with Mikel Thor up of The Expat Money Show and lots of really cool guests and topics about offshore living. I'm giving a talk on living in Europe with the Digital Nomad Visa so you don't wanna miss it. You can register using the link in the show notes, um, or on our website Badass Digital Nomads on the webpage with this episode. And if you're listening to today's episode later and you missed the live summit and want to watch the replay, you can still register below to get access to that. Expat Money is a virtual summit, but I'll also be speaking in person at the Nomad Island Fest in Madeira, Portugal, which is running from December 1st through seventh of 2022. So that's going to be a lot of fun. I'm also going to be DJing at the event. Yes, DJ Kristin is making an appearance and so you don't wanna miss that either. If you can make it to Portugal next month, then I will post the link to get your ticket in the show notes as well. Those are the updates I have for you today. Hope you're having a great day and enjoy my conversation with Alex Fasulo.  

Podcast Interview:

Kristin:    00:09:00    So you mentioned that you are in Florida right now, you're on the west coast of Florida, right?  

Alex:    00:09:06    Yeah, I'm in the Fort Myers region down by the Everglades.  

Kristin:    00:09:10    Do you have any travel coming up planned for the end of the year or 2023?  

Alex:    00:09:16    Yeah, I actually have a lot starting tomorrow. It's, that's specifically why I wanted to chat today cause I'm driving from Florida to New York starting tomorrow and then I'm going back and forth between New York City and upstate New York and Vermont for three weeks and then I'm coming back and then like the big thing I have planned is November, I'm going to England, London and Scotland. So I'm really excited  

Kristin:    00:09:40    <laugh>. That sounds fun. And why did you choose that area?  

Alex:    00:09:43    I've never been and I've always felt a pole, like I've always wanted to go there. I love British culture I guess you would say. Like I love their TV shows, their movies, their books, their music. My favorite band's British, so I've always wanted to go and it's always been one of those places where it's like, oh England, you know, I'm gonna go to Japan or I'm gonna go wherever cuz it's England. But now I'm like no, I wanna go to England. I know everyone goes to England but I wanna go to England. So I'm really excited. I've always felt this pole to go there.  

Kristin:    00:10:10    Are you gonna do a road trip there?  

Alex:    00:10:13    I wasn't planning on it cuz I definitely don't feel comfortable driving on the left side of the road <laugh>, but I'll take a lot of trains. <laugh>.  

Kristin:    00:10:19    Yeah and you, you're just gonna go by yourself or is your friend slash assistant coming?  

Alex:    00:10:25    I'm gonna actually go by myself for the first few days, which is new for me. And then she was gonna meet me out there and actually a few of my other virtual friends are gonna be there as well. So I actually think I'm gonna see a bunch of people, you know, kind of on my way there. But it's the first time I'm gonna go alone.  

Kristin:    00:10:42    That's nice. That's a good time to go. I know people would think that that sounds weird because it's going into winter but I really like going to Europe in the fall because usually the weather is not so bad yet. It's still not that cold and it's less crowded.  

Alex:    00:10:56    Yeah, exactly. And I know they go hard for Christmas and everything so I actually was speaking to a guy from London a couple days ago and he said the time I'm going they'll have all their Christmas markets out and everything. It's actually a great time. He's like it won't be as crowded and the Christmas markets will be out so I'm happy.  

Kristin:    00:11:15    Yeah, well I might see you there cuz I'm planning on going back to Europe in around that time in October -November. So yeah, we'll have to keep in touch there. I know we have so much in common with like our love of all things remote work and I also heard another podcast that you are interested in doing voiceover work and that you also like DJing and electronic music, which we've chatted about on Instagram, which I've gotten really into too. So the dream would be like I could play a DJ gig in England and you and your friends could come.

Alex:    00:11:51    <laugh>. That sounds amazing.

Kristin:    00:11:53    Let's  make that happen.  

Alex:    00:11:54    Yes, I know. Gosh, I love EDM, I love it.  

Kristin:    00:11:58    I saw a post that you had <laugh> that you designed your table as like a medieval table because why not? And because everything's made up anyway and that was very random and cool. Is this a new mindset for you of like F it I'm just gonna do whatever I want because I can or was that always your mindset growing up in this small town in upstate New York and now you just have the resources to be able to do it?  

Alex:    00:12:28    That's a great question. So I would say an element of that has been part of me my entire life from when I was a little kid. Like I definitely always marched to the beat of my own drum. I would talk back to authority very young. It's definitely always been part of me to question everything and not wanna go along with what's normal. But I would say it's more recent to me at age 29 now that I've kind of come into this new era of creative confidence. Whereas like I would call that was just general life confidence. But I have been feeling more confident in my own creativity really than ever honestly in the last year. And that kind of new element of I'm gonna decorate my table like it's a medieval table because F it like that is new to the last year cuz still throughout most of my twenties I would always dress like, I always dress eccentrically and everything like that, but really I got the confidence to be like, you know what, I wanna decorate my house so weird and I don't have an F who thinks that it's cool or not. And I just kind of came to this, I don't know, natural place with it this past spring and it feels amazing. You know, it feels like so freeing to just buy goblets and put it on my table and if someone's like, wow, that's so weird, I'd be like, okay <laugh>, I like them. You know? So the creativity and the creative confidence is more recent I would say.  

Kristin:    00:13:51    Yeah, that probably comes a bit with working for yourself as well and achieving success in a job that you invented that you know, and it's a job that other people have. But you've created this online business model of a personal brand slash freelancer slash now influencer and somebody who's in the media. For people who haven't come across your work before, how was your job different before back in pre freelancing, Alex? Like 2012 to 2015,  

Alex:    00:14:28    I didn't work very long in like the corporate office world. I graduated when in 2014 and I went to work first at an office job in politics in New York state. That was, to be honest, I loved my coworkers and my bosses there, but I was really rebelling, rejecting the whole office setting. So I thought like oh maybe I just need another job. So I got this PR job in New York City cause I really wanted to, to leave Albany where I'm from. I was like, I wanna get outta here, I'm gonna go to New York City, the big city and I'm gonna get a new job. And I got there and this job was like 50 times worse than my job in Albany. And that's when I kind of had this epiphany where I'm like, huh, I don't think me in offices mix. So do I have a problem here?  

Alex:    00:15:10    You know, because we're so brainwashed into thinking like that's kind of it for the two thousands. Like you better like working in an office, I was like, all right, I hate this so much. I'm crying, I'm miserable, I'm destroyed. I hate the people who were kiss as awful, as toxic and then I recklessly quit it with no, you know, additional office job plan. Cuz at that point I was saying enough to go okay, I'm noticing a theme here for me so maybe I should try and make money not in an office. And that was kind of my whole idea with it. I had no prior skillsets on side hustling or anything. It just kind of became this whole self-taught journey that I'm still on today, you know, almost I guess. Wow. Like seven years, eight years later. Crazy.  

Kristin:    00:15:57    And how did you settle on writing? Did you try different skills and that was the one that stuck or walk us through your first day setting up your freelancing profile?  

Alex:    00:16:08    Yeah, so I tried out a bunch of things at the same time cause I was so desperate to not go back to an office. So I've always liked writing. I didn't consider myself to be the most prolific writer that ever walked the earth or anything like that. But I always liked writing so that was one of the things I tried. I tried listing, you know, I'll write for your blog. I had never written for a blog before. This was major, fake it till you make it, you know? So I listed that. I also listed social media management, you know, being 22 at the time. I was like I can post on Instagram for older people or whatever. So I tried that one out. I tried a bunch of things like website design, which I'm terrible at and I hate I, I tried it all and I tried it all at the exact same time.  

Alex:    00:16:48    So it was very chaotic. Not a lot of sleeping, not a lot of knowing what the heck is going on and it's kind of a boring answer. But writing is just what happened to take off. I didn't really go like it better be writing it, better be writing. It's the one that happened to take off. I mean ironically I love to write the most so I guess it's not ironic, you know, that's probably why it took off cuz my genuine excitement was there for it and people can feel that on the other end. So writing is what took off, but I was willing to have anything take off to not go back in an office. Truly  

Kristin:    00:17:19    That is very significant what you just said because I think what a lot of people do and myself included is we go through life trying to figure out what we should do, what we should take action on, what we're good at, what's our life purpose. And I heard someone talk the other day about changing your mindset around from ready, aim, fire to ready, fire, aim. And it sounds like that's what you did. You were like, I'm ready to work for myself, I'm ready to get out of an office, let me throw a bunch of mud at the wall and see what sticks. And then one thing sticks <laugh> and then you go from there. Exactly. How did you even have the courage and the mindset to be like I can do this or whatever, but you were also charging prices commiserate with your experience. So you started at what, $5 per blog or something like that? And then how long did it take for you to work your way up over the years?  

Alex:    00:18:21    Yeah, so I feel like it was a mixture of courage, stupidity, stubbornness and being humble enough to charge the low rates and recognize that I didn't have the experience to charge a hundred dollars for a blog starting out. Cause I have a lot of people come to me and be like, well I'm worth more than a $25 blog. And I'll be like, well says who? Everyone has to earn their keep. Everyone has to get testimonials, y'all have to start somewhere. So I feel like I was like humble enough to be like, you know what, I'm gonna charge like $5 cuz I don't know what the I'm doing and if I only charge $5 they're not gonna get that mad at me and we can kind of do this whole thing together. And I slowly raised my prices and it ended up working out. So I went from five to 10 to 15, hung around 15 to 25 for a while. Mind you, this is still back in like 2016. So I tell people now you don't have to start at $5, you can start at like 15 with inflation and everything. I always joke, I'm like back in my day when we charge  five bucks kids,  

Alex:    00:19:16    You know what that's like and everyone will complain. I'm like, I used to write stuff for $5. I raised it over a couple months to about 20, $25 and by the third month I was able to sometimes hit $100 days, which back in 2016 or whatever was enough for me to pay my rent. You know, that was enough for me and I was happy. I was like I don't have to go back into an office. I'm probably gonna make like $35,000 a year for the rest of my life. I'm not trying to sound, I'm not aware that that's still a great living for so many people in the world. You know like I know I was living in New York City is the only thing you know. So I was like, I kind need this but I can at least pay my bills. So I don't care if I have to eat ramen.  

Alex:    00:19:55    Like I don't have to sit in an office, I get to walk around to museums for free every day. Like I'm living life right now. I'm so happy with this. And the traveling I did, I did all like the cheap stuff. Like I went to Iceland, I camped all over Iceland's, it's free. It was such a bad idea. I didn't have the right. It was all so bad. But it was like that's the stuff I look back on now and I'm like that's amazing that I did that. It's funny that I did that. Yeah. And I just kept slowly raising them. And then you know, something funny happened after a couple years of just working hard, keeping my head down, being happy, being grateful, excited, all that stuff. Fiverr launched its fiber pro program which you know Upwork has at the equivalent now it's the top 1% program you can get into and then all of a sudden, you know, your stuff goes from $25 to $100 and the next thing you know you're making 10, 15K a month and your life is never the same again. And it's all because for three years I just did what I needed to do and I was content with it.  

Kristin:    00:20:50    Yeah, that's like the 80/20 rule and it probably is the same on Fiverr as well. Like 20% of the freelancers make 80% of the income and then once you get into the top 10%, 5%, 2% of freelancers on the site, your income just grows exponentially because you're getting more visibility there. I'm sure. And I actually saw that you read the 80/20 principle book, which came up twice today for me. There must be Google's listening to me or listening to my thoughts or something. What was your biggest takeaway from that besides the course, the title of the book?  

Alex:    00:21:26    I know that book had a lot of interesting stuff in it. I think that book was a good reminder to me cuz I sometimes can err on the side of work, work, work, you know, work hard, work hard, hustle, hustle. I grew up like watching my mom like that and everything. So that book kind of opened my eyes up to this idea that we spend 80% of our time being only happy 20% of the time.  So we we're comfortable with this idea that we should be bored and working hard and unhappy for 80% of the time. And when we vacation, you know, that's when life's good and that's it. And he argues, you know, why don't you flip that, why don't you just spend 20% of your time doing the stuff you don't wanna do and why don't you spend 80% of your time doing stuff you actually wanna be doing? Like that might not involve making money sometimes maybe you take off for two months. And I was like wow, that's a crazy concept. And he says, you know, if you spend 80% of your time genuinely happy and having fun and laughing, that's gonna give the universe more opportunities to bring abundance. What's next for you? Everything your way if you're in that happy place. So I was like, because that goes directly against how we're programmed. Yeah. In our society. Like directly against it.  

Kristin:    00:22:36    Yes. Because we're a programmed that there's never enough. Like no matter how much you make or how much you work, you can always be making more, you can be doing more, you can be climbing higher on the ladder, you can be growing in this, but it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive. As this shift has shown of people working remotely, it's like oh wait, well you can work 14 hours a day and work remotely or you can work four hours a day and that it doesn't have to always be this trade off. When did you reach the tipping point where you switched from writing blogs to ghost writing and thinking of your career as a freelancer more as a business?  

Alex:    00:23:20    Great questions. These are great questions

.  

Kristin:    00:23:22    I've done this before. <laugh>.  

Alex:    00:23:24    Yeah. I'm like man, I could spin this into TikTok. So I wish I could write this down right now. I would say when I got added into Fiverr Pro in 2017, that was the first time I had received feedback from the marketplace I was in that my talent, my skills were worthy of being in this premier program. So that was the first time I got like official validation in my industry that I wasn't bad at what I was doing. So once that happened, it kind of gave me the idea to maybe start taking this all more seriously than I had been. I mean I was taking it very seriously but I was more so thinking like, well maybe I'm not bad at this. Maybe I should look into things that I can make more money doing this. Maybe I can take on harder stuff. So like I always do, I always stalk my competition on anything I'm doing.  

Alex:    00:24:09    I always go find 10 other people doing exactly what I'm doing and I look at everything they're doing, every word, every price, and I, I watch out all of it, not in a creepy way, you know, just market research. And so I noticed some of the people at the time funny if mostly women at the time were selling e-Books or ghost writing an e-Books. I was like, Hey, what's that? What I don't even know. I'm like what's an ebook? This was all like five years ago for anyone listening to this. Things happened very quickly in the text space. But yes, I went and looked all this stuff up, I was like, okay, I think I get this. I think I could maybe write an e-book. And a kind of funny thing happened where it was one day I was thinking about doing it but I was like, do I have the experience? Do I have the credentials for this? You know all that talk in your head? And somebody out of the blue on Fiverr messaged me and they're like, Hey I really like the blog you wrote for me. Do you write eBooks? And I was like,  

Kristin:    00:25:00    <laugh>

Alex:    00:25:02    And nothing  is coincidence. Nothing is coincidence. 

Alex:    00:25:04    I was like, I don't but I'd be willing to try one out with you for a hugely discounted rate between the two of us if you're down. And they were like, oh my god, yeah I bet you you know your blog was grant but this eBooks gonna be great for only like 300 bucks. Let's do it. I was like okay. And then once that happens, like the rest is history once you get through the first one and it works out that way. And it kind of just one thing led to another. The e-Books gig grew so quickly and it's a lot of work with e-Books that it then gave me the idea by my fourth year that, duh, I should get some help here <laugh>. I don't need to do this all alone forever. It's been great for four years. I've had fun but you know, maybe I want a little time to not have to check my business every single day, including weekends.  

Alex:    00:25:50    Maybe I should take a a step away from my baby. I, I guess I would refer to it. So I started to hire one person to write with me for years. Just one person. I move very slowly with this stuff cuz I'm very careful, I don't wanna let it go by accident and whatever. So that was kind of, it all just naturally progressed and now you find me in a crazy place where I don't do any of it anymore. But that's cuz again anyone listening, I'm almost heading into eight years doing this so I don't recommend totally stepping out of it like your first year.  

Kristin:    00:26:20    No. Yeah you need to create that foundation. And I just heard a quote recently. It's like the stronger the foundation, the taller the building, like the deeper the roots of the tree, the higher the tree can grow. And you spent those first six or seven years really in the weeds planting everything and then now it can grow with or without you and allow you time to expand and do other things. How did you end up on CNBC Make it?  

Alex:    00:26:51    So they reached out to Fiverr, it was through Fiverr that I had that first feature with them in 2018 and it was when Fiverr launched Fiverr Pro. So they reached out to Fiverr I'm guessing asking you know, have you had people with make a lot of money with this program? And Fiverr connected me with them, uh as well as a bunch of other freelancers I think. So that was how the first story started back in 2018. And then all the subsequent stuff since then, it's just been now I know the people there all the time. People write to me, they're like, can I have your contact at CNBC? I'm like, I'll give you anything else but that I'm sorry. And I've just gotten along with them. They really like the like side hustle stories. So they ran like a big video feature on me last year, which is kind of crazy. It really blew my stuff up. It was like a little hard kind of to have that much public attention slash hate from it. Then this year they reached out to me and they gave me a contributor account, which is amazing with them. So I've loved working with them and I do owe it to Fiverr who they made the initial connection.  

Kristin:    00:27:53    That's amazing because you didn't plan that. And that's one of the things that I love seeing when people are following what they want to do is that these happy accidents happen and these coincidences and synchronicities and sadly CNBC reached out to me but they wanted to do a feature on me only if I was living in another country. And I was thinking I've been in other countries for my entire life and the one time I'm not in another country, <laugh> CNBC wants to profile me. I was like ugh. So I'll talk to you in a few months maybe So we'll see. But then and so then that opened a lot of other doors for you and and not to say that everyone that goes on Fiverr is gonna end up on CNBC or even wants to be on CNBC, but these kinds of opportunities that come out of just pursuing something that you know, you could have never envisioned. I'm sure when you started writing offering social media management and writing blogs for $5 per blog that a few years later you were gonna be on CNBC and having a book coming out as well. 

Alex:    00:29:02    People  would probably think I'm like trying to humble brag or something, but this is the total honest truth. Like I still don't understand how half of this happened. I just like, I act like I know what I'm doing just cuz I love to learn and share information. I love being a teacher and all that. So it's like I love all of it but I still like can't believe I wrote a book and a book's coming out that I wrote. Like I'm just like I gotta do some catch up I guess with my mindset maybe that I'm like deserving of it or something. I don't know if there's like a disconnect going on there, but I never in a million, million –million years imagined that this would be my life ever. Some days I'm like, I wrote a book -book. I don't even remember writing the book but I wrote it. I think  

Kristin:    00:29:44    I don't either. I –I think it's because you kind of channel the information somehow or that must be the creative process. I, I feel like that with music too. When I do a DJ set and I listen back to it, I don't even remember what I did. I'm like what was that effect I used? Like how did I do that? What you know. So how did the idea for the book come about? So tell people like what's the title of the book, what is it about, who is it for?  

Alex:    00:30:10    So it's called Freelance Your Way to Freedom and it kind of just naturally, so there's so many books I wanna write in my life so it's you know, hard like which one do I write first and my book agent and I like it just kind of this was the natural first one for us to do. It's a pretty catchall one cause I'm a new author and everything so it's basically like a self-help freelance bible type of thing that it basically includes every single thing I know about opening up your laptop and making money online. So it's very much a business book cuz I'm a new author. It doesn't include as much of, you know, my personal story in it. It's more of a self-help where there's bullet points at the end of each chapter type of thing. So it's designed to be this kind of freelance bible that somebody could buy if they're thinking of quitting their job or they wanna learn how to make money on the side or they don't know understand what freelancing is or they don't know how to sell their services as a freelancer. Like all of it is answered in this book with a lot of sassy jokes that I threw in there.  

Kristin:    00:31:09    <laugh>. I love it. You just reminded me cuz I was telling you like I have a course called Freelance to Freedom because I do believe that freelancing is freedom and I think a lot of online business owners start out that way. And even though I didn't start out freelancing on freelancing sites because to be honest I didn't know that they existed when I started selling services. Anyone who's selling services that they provide is basically an independent contractor and that's how I started out in real estate earning commissions as a contractor and then creating a relocation service and then charging a fee for it. Which I found my first clients on social media And then, you know, I never had a freelancing profile but then it was like word of mouth and I made a website and yada yada yada. But what do you think are some of the preconceptions or misconceptions that people have about freelancing that prevents them from seizing that opportunity? Like they just stay in a job that they hate because they don't think that that could be for them or they don't think that they can do it or maybe that they're gonna make enough money doing it?  

Alex:    00:32:19    You know what, I think the number one thing that holds people up is, is the bureaucracy of it. Meaning taxes, healthcare and retirement. I think people believe that if they leave their job they're gonna be very irresponsible and they're never gonna have healthcare again. They're never gonna have a retirement or a 401k, they're never gonna know how to do their taxes. I honestly think it's that element of it that stops people the most just from what I've seen on all my social media. And I obviously talk about all that in the book, but I feel like corporations have done this really good job of creating an illusion that they A care and B, that they're like helping you with this stuff where people don't realize like you are still paying for your health insurance at your corporate job. They just like package it in a way where it sounds like you're not but you are.  

Alex:    00:33:08    And with a lot of these places, you know they, they'll match your 401k. That sounds great again in theory, but so many studies have shown freelancers and it's like 70% of freelancers you will make more money than you did at your corporate job. So I always say, you know, you're gonna have more money to to set aside at a younger age so that money's gonna grow and you're gonna have so much more money in your retirement than you would at a corporate job. And that gets in like the financial weeds. So people start to just stare at me like what am I talking about? And then with taxes I think people get really scared but I've been reading a lot of books on taxes, you know, are tax codes written in a way to incentivize people to start businesses, to create jobs, to create housing.  

Alex:    00:33:46    And the more you do that stuff, the more tax breaks you get. So by creating jobs, by investing money, by doing all these things I do, I am not taxed as high as someone who would make my equivalent salary at a corporate job. Now mind you, I still paid an arm and a leg and taxes like I'm not not paying taxes, trust me. But I think people just end up so brainwashed with the bureaucracy of it all that they think they need like this corporation to, to save them or to be the liaison for them with these scary government things. And I'm really passionate about telling people that's just not the case. 

Kristin:    00:34:22    Yeah I, I just saw a book, I was in FedEx shipping some stuff the other day and just picked up a book at the counter and it was written by an economist and he was talking about that, I can't remember the title at the moment, but he was saying how everything is made so complex that even if you were to bring a bunch of economists and financial advisors in a room and ask them like how much does someone making $53,000 per year have to save to have this much money in retirement? Like no one could answer that question because we don't get any personal finance instruction in school and then we're just kind of shuffled into the workforce where that's all conveniently taken care of for us but it's not in our best interest And there are a lot of benefits to working as an independent contractor.  

Kristin:    00:35:11    There are some drawbacks which we can talk about the other side as well. But I even put in my book when I, I wrote some statistics about how freelancers can make more than salaried workers or how they do a certain percentage and the editor was like, I don't know if we can say this like do we wanna say this? I'm like, but this is the statistic. Yeah like we're going to say what the statistics is because it's true. It's not like we're painting this picture that it's too good to be true. It's like the actual reality and that doesn't mean that you don't have to work for it or that it might take some time, maybe a few years to build up and then replace your salary from your corporate job. And of course it depends how much you make and everything like that. But that was kind of eye-opening to me that there's this public perception that freelancers are somehow, you know, not as esteemed in society as someone with a certain salary job with a certain job title. What are your thoughts on that? 

Alex:    00:36:12    Yeah,  No I think there's a huge gap. I believe it's gonna be closed though in the coming years. I really think we're kind of at like the forefront of this big shift that's gonna happen in the labor market. And what's funny is I'm never like cheering for a recession or any type of scenario where people aren't doing well economically obviously. But historically when these moments of recessions and everything come through they kind of are almost needed to clean out the current system and usher in the new innovation and what's next and what's to come. So I really think, you know, if we're gonna head into an economic downturn, I'll just call it that as people get all up in arms what you label it. I think on the other side of it, a year or two, three years from now, I really think that this kind of looking down on freelancers, not acknowledging it, not thinking it's a real thing, I think that's gonna be gone on the other side of this cuz I keep posting all these articles.  

Alex:    00:37:02    I just actually did a YouTube video on this where 75% of companies polled in an article said they prefer to hire freelancers during uh, recession as opposed to hiring employees cuz they have to pay for all those benefits and 85% of companies said they are planning to administer hiring freezes starting in September. So it's just kind of crazy that all of this is happening at the same time. I'm like wow this is so weird that I like to have all this knowledge about this and it's all of a sudden gonna maybe become relevant and like the news and this is crazy. And I really think on the other side of whatever's to come, I don't think freelancers will be seen that way anymore. I think they'll start to become just a normal thing that your neighbor's a freelancer.  

Kristin:    00:37:45    Hey there, hope you've been enjoying today's episode and if you've been interested in getting into freelancing someday but you're not sure where to start or what skills you can monetize online, then check out my online course Freelance to Freedom, which walks you step by step into getting started in freelancing in just 30 days. You can find it by using the link in the show notes or by going to www.digitalnomadbootcamp.com. That's digitalnomadbootcamp.com.  

Kristin:    00:38:22    The other thing that I think will start happening is that a certain percentage of freelancers that want to will start to become entrepreneurs that create all different types of businesses because that becomes sort of the organic evolution of being a freelancer. I mean you start maybe with one service, one offering and then you start to split them up or package them together and then 7, 8, 10 years down the road you could have an agency for that thing that you do. And what I wrote about in the past was how freelancers, I used it as digital nomads because that's what I was writing about a lot but a lot of digital nomads were and are freelancers. But I was writing about how digital nomads and freelancers and people at our location independent can work online that they would actually start competing with their former employers or with their industry.  

Kristin:    00:39:20    So instead of just being the employee, they would become the employer, which I think is a really cool shift and things kind of flip upside down and I think a lot of us are still in that mindset that you mentioned earlier of mentally arriving at that realization of actually how powerful each one of us are as individuals and what our earning potential can be rather than looking at it a salary or a glass ceiling operating as many business entities and not necessarily even many but you know, maybe there's a few Elon Musks in the mix that are like freelancers that then end up building rockets or something.  

Alex:    00:40:02    Yeah, I say to people who I've done like consultations, I, I don't do them anymore but in the past I would say what's funny if you branch out and you leave what's normal to go become a freelancer, yes you have the income from the actual services you're selling, but it also creates this foundation, this brand of you as a freelancer. If you start sharing it on social media, you're gonna get followers. Cuz it's interesting cuz it's not normal if you start sharing, oh I've been doing this for three years. You can write an ebook about it and sell that on your website. You can offer downloads on how to write better blogs if you're a copywriter on your website and next thing you know just cuz you made a decision to do something not normal. There's like so many different spinoff brands, businesses, income that can come in from that one decision. And I think that's what's so cool about it, that's how you achieve financial freedom is having all of these different tentacles, you know, coming out of you.  

Kristin:    00:40:56    Definitely. And you've been so transparent about that. Can you share with some people what your different income streams are so they can get an idea of the big picture. It doesn't have to be like this much money from this one, this one, whatever, but just like the lay of the land.  

Alex:    00:41:12    Yeah, so right now it's always shifting. Like my business is definitely like a living, breathing entities. It's always shifting. So right now I have my freelancing agency that my best friend runs for me. So that's completely passive which is amazing. I have brand deals and partnerships from doing influencing content. I make ad revenue through my YouTube account and my website. I have downloadable PDFs on my website. I have online courses, I had eBooks up but I pulled them all for my book which is coming you know, in November. So those are the main five I think that was, those are the main ones right now and most of them are passive, which has always been my goal after seven years of very active income and trading time for money. So I'm really trying to passive as much of my business as possible.  

Kristin:    00:41:57    Right. To automate all of that. Well I, there's this whole conversation online it's like is passive income passive? It can be passive but it requires the setup costs and then it requires some maintenance and some ongoing costs. So what would you say is your number one revenue source?  

Alex:    00:42:15    Well that's a good question. Right now it actually is pinballing around each month just always be freelancing income. Since I have a team and writers and everything, you know, I take home about 35% of what is made through that. So it no longer makes me like the huge money at once did it switches up between that brand deals and partnerships and my education content. So courses and PDFs. So it actually depends the month which one it is for the first time for me.  

Kristin:    00:42:44    What would you say is your biggest struggle right now as a business owner?  

Alex:    00:42:49    Oh alright. I would say it's probably my natural disorganization slash shiny object syndrome. I love to discover new things, start new things, get excited about new things and then after two years I get bored. So I feel like that can be a good and bad thing, right? That I'm like always looking ahead, always wanting to know what's happening but it can create a huge organizational mess in my wake. Which is why I hired my best friend basically to be my full-time paper finance, whatever organizer. Cuz without her I could not do this. I'm always very frank about that, that I need somebody to organize things for me or it becomes a disaster.  

Kristin:    00:43:30    Yeah and I think that's fine. That's why people hire people that compliment your weaknesses. Yeah and that's why I have a bookkeeper <laugh> an accountant. Yeah. And I've seen you posting a lot on uh, social media about different books that you're reading and hobbies and things like that. What are some of the topics that you are learning about in your personal time?  

Alex:    00:43:54    Oh My gosh. So I have been reading a book a week, which means my brain is exploding with like information and exciting topics right now. It's like too much. I've been reading about everything from like an introduction into psychology and the different egos in our body to quantum physics to authority, submitting yourself to authority, when do people break from it to the psychology of money to financial management. I'm reading like everything right now and I'm loving it but it definitely fuels my, we should do this, we should do that, we should do this. And then Bria should be like, okay Alex, I'm I'm happy or excited but like come back down to planet Earth. So I've been reading yet, it's like a lot of spirituality, psychology, quantum physics, energy, all that stuff that people love when it's all brought up at dinner. It's my favorite thing to do.  

Kristin:    00:44:42    <laugh>. Yeah, I'm always in that tension between wanting to read a lot of books and I have like this huge bookshelf next to me but then wanting to integrate and implement what I've learned but then also wanting to start the next book. So are there any books that you've gone back and reread?  

Alex:    00:45:02    You know, not yet but the, my one favorite book of the last two years I'm due to reread again is Big Magic by Elizabeth Gilbert. And that one was like opened a door for me actually into like this creative liberation I find myself in right now. And I feel like everybody should read that book because it talks about the concept of creativity and how every human has access to creativity. Cause that's another thing in our society today, people have been told that there are creatives and there are non creatives. I hate that concept. I hate it when people are like, oh I'm a creative. I'm like, no, you're just a human. That taps into creativity. Like we're all creative. Yeah, yeah. You're not special. I'm sorry to tell you that but no, the, the book does a really good job of explaining how there's an unlimited amount of creativity for everyone to access and like just because I'm accessing it doesn't mean there's any less for you. And I really think every adult could read that book cuz I think we've all had that child like wonder beaten out of us in school and college and everything.  

Kristin:    00:46:03    Definitely I'm, I'm putting that on my list because I didn't know that that's what that book was about. But I read, eat, pray, love as did many people and I've read a lot in different books recently that confirms what you just said. And I don't know if it's confirmation bias or if it's because it's truth but something I've been mulling over in my journal is just that, that everyone is creative by virtue of being born on this planet. And we're told this lie to divide us into this is labels like a creative person, a non-creative person, an artist, not an artist. And I had to even go back and do my own work and psychoanalysis to figure out why did I think I wasn't creative and it was because I wasn't good at drawing. Like I didn't know how to draw more than stick figures I think in art class. And like my third grade art teacher was like, oh yeah, you're not an artist And like this offhanded comment from this teacher like ruined the first part of my life.  

Alex:    00:47:07    <laugh>. I know. Isn't that crazy when you look back on stuff like that? Cause I had a lot of peripheral family members kind of crap on my poetry when I was super young. And like that was enough for me to kind of shut down this whole dark academia side of myself that's always been in me that I like never gave permission to come out because I thought, oh by the time I was 18 I was like, oh I, I suck at poetry, you know I'm not like Shakespearean or anything like that. You know, I should just get a job in politics instead. It's just like from those few comments you hear from your family members, it's crazy how like fragile you are.  

Kristin:    00:47:42    Yeah and I think from our current positions of having been able to talk to thousands of people in red, tens of thousands of comments on social media, on YouTube videos, you start to see patterns, right? And I don't know about you but one of the patterns I've seen is that when people finally retire or their kids grow up and move on and move out of the house or they have a big life change like they get divorced or they quit their job or they move to a new city, their next step is always that they want to do something creative that they abandoned early on in life. Do you see that?  

Alex:    00:48:20    Oh my god, yeah. I mean that was me too almost really. Cuz I realized once I gave myself permission to love all of this that I've always loved writing. I just kept trying to tell myself that I didn't wanna be a writer, you know, cause oh she's, I'm not good enough to be a writer or whatever. But I see it across the board with people every time they're like, I'm gonna quit my job and like open an avocado truck. I'm gonna drive down the road and make like avocado ice cream. I'm like do it Like I've always loved cooking even though I was just a surgeon. I'm like, who says you're only one thing you know, I hate that too. They're like, oh you're an accountant, you can't also be a dancer. Like says who? Yeah <laugh>, what does that mean?  

Kristin:    00:48:55    There's been this, all of this um, anger over the prime minister of Finland for dancing her friend's house and that makes my blood boil.  

Alex:    00:49:05    I saw your post. I was like, yes girl <laugh> in an effort to control people by telling them they belong in that box or they belong in that box or men should do this and women should do that. It's all in an effort to control people and yeah and it's all in an effort to make money at the end of the day and all these companies put you in a box so you think you need to buy this cuz they told you, well you're part of this box or this political party or whatever and then everyone's controlled and don't get me started on this.  

Kristin:    00:49:32    Yeah we need to have like a dinner party and talk about this for hours. I could remember back in college, I must have been in high school, maybe high school, college. I remember reading the course catalog at UCF and basically going through each major and being like, Nope, nope, can't do that. Not good at that. That doesn't make money crossing out things related to filmmaking and acting and basically anything creative. I was like oh no cuz I had this thing in my head that only 1% of people that do that can make a living at it and I'll just be a starving artist working at restaurants the rest of my life trying to live on tips or something. And I don't know where that comes from but I guess the message I kind of wanna leave people with is that if they feel that way too, that they're not alone.

Kristin:    00:50:23    That both you and I had those insecurities and now we, we see thousands of other people that thought that they had to live in a linear way where they had to finish their career in accounting before they could do anything artistic or creative. And I think that's where lack of fulfillment comes from in life cuz people aren't allowing themselves to do the things that they like. And I think that's why you and I get so excited about the situation with, even though the pandemic was horrible on so many levels that it freed so many people but it might just take a few years for that freedom to catch up with the mindset of the greater collective. Do you think that's the case?  

Alex:    00:51:07    Yeah, that made me think of one of the many books I read in the last like two months. There was a quote in one of them, I have to remember which one, and it said if anybody is ever unhappy or a miserable person, the extent to which they're miserable is how far away they are from living their actual purpose. And I like blew my mind if someone's just like slightly agitated all the time, it means they're like kind of dipping into what their soul actually wants to be doing but not fully. And if someone's horribly mean to everyone around them, it's because they are so far away from what their soul wants to be doing. That's how you explain everyone's unhappiness. And I was like,  

Kristin:    00:51:42    Oh my god, that's exactly what I saw. I've talked about this before on the podcast, but I saw in a museum in Norway, Hitler's secret paintings, he was a closet artist who did not allow himself to pursue his art and therefore started World War II.  

Alex:    00:52:03    Yeah, actually one of the books I've read to talked about how most of the horrible, horrible dictators, these crazy manipulators throughout history have all been these artists or typically actors or writers who didn't get their books out, didn't get to act on stage, didn't get to paint, and it kind of triggered this horrible power trip in all of them. And he was like trying to make a joke that the next time someone wants you to look at their painting, just tell them it looks nice <laugh>. Because most of the time it's these failed artists type people that go on to do horrible stuff.  

Kristin:    00:52:34    Yeah. That's really important I think for people to just not feel afraid to do it and to feel okay with sucking for a while. Cuz I also read something else that was talking about how time is such a gift because if you see something that you want or something that makes you jealous or anything that triggers you, it's like a sign that that is something that you can be or that you are. So let's say you wanna be an actress and you're just obsessed with all of these beautiful actresses from different time periods. That's a assign to follow that. And it was talking about how time is a gift to just give you the time to be who you are. And that was a real mindset shift for me because now not only am I aware that creativity is infinite and limitless and universal and you can just tap into it at any time, at any age and doing whatever it is that you want.  

Kristin:    00:53:30    So it's not like the burden's on you to be creative, the burden is on you to just sit down and let creativity come through you. So that was a huge mindset shift. And then the other thing was knowing that anything that you see can be yours or already is yours if you just start the process and then wait <laugh>. So you just start and then keep walking until you get to that thing. But the irony of it is that the misery is in between, right? The misery is in where you are to where you want to be. And that's why in this current age of the world in our society today, we think that we have to be miserable in that space in between. And really that's where life happens.  

Alex:    00:54:16    Yes. I don't even have anything to adding. Is that like perfectly ties in all the different books we've been referencing? That's been my takeaway from all these books is we've been sold this lie that you have to like suffer in any way. They have to suffer to make money, you have to suffer to be successful, you have to give up something to gain something. It's all not true. That doesn't need to be this trade. Like you don't need to go to the universe, God, whoever, and be like, okay, here, take this so I can get that. Like they'll just give it to you if you just wait and allow yourself to arrive there.  

Kristin:    00:54:48    Yeah, it really is quite simple and your proof that it can be done. Well let's take it from our philosophical conversation into a few practical tips before I let you go. For people that are just new to freelancing or even that are already freelancing, but they were kind of like us, they were winging it as they went along, they're like, I don't really know what I'm doing but I can do this thing so let me charge money for it. What are some of the basic freelancer tool set of either software tools or things that people need just to kind of get started?  

Alex:    00:55:24    All right, so I use a lot of software now just because I have a team. So do you want me to talk about like what I use right now?  

Kristin:    00:55:30    Let's say if you were advising like a few years ago, one of your clients, like someone who called you who wanted help getting into freelancing. Would they just basically need like a freelancing profile and a bank account?  

Alex:    00:55:45    Yeah, I mean it's kind of hard actually to break that one down. In the very beginning all I used was Fiverr and Word doc. Like that's all I used every day. I to tell you it's awesome. 

Kristin:    00:55:55    That's awesome.  

Alex:    00:55:56    So I always wanna let people know that so that they don't feel overwhelmed thinking they need to like get all this different software. I only added on these tools as I built the business out. So if you are brand new, you can get by with just Word document and Fiverr or Upwork like that can be enough. Uh, now where I am today I use QuickBooks to track payments that go out to different people on my team. I use Slack is how I do my instant messaging with with everyone to assign out projects. My favorite thing ever is Notion if anyone's heard of that one. I've built out like directions on how to do everything I need for my virtual assistance for whatever. And it's a one huge like note taking organization software. Unbelievable. I use Loom to record videos of myself explaining how to do things for people to check that one out. I use Flow Desk for uh, my emails. I can keep going. I use a lot of stuff now, but in the beginning it was just me and Word document.  

Kristin:    00:56:52    Well wait, what's Flow Desk?  

Alex:    00:56:54    So it's like MailChimp, but it has way more aesthetically pleasing templates. It's much like, I call it more feminine looking than MailChimp.  

Kristin:    00:57:01    Okay. Yeah, MailChimp is OG but it's more basic. When you were first starting out on Fiverr, how did you communicate with your clients? Just through the messaging system there.  

Alex:    00:57:12    Yeah. Yep. Because you're not supposed to take like clients off of Fiverr, right? You don't want them contacting me off of five anyway, so you just download the app to your phone, you turn on the notifications and you can instant message them right on your phone, which is what made it all doable cuz you can be out and about all day and still answering the clients and they're still happy and you don't have to be sitting at your computer.  

Kristin:    00:57:33    What do you think is the biggest thing that helped you get more clients? Was it some sort of bonus or thing that you offered on your profile or the way it was structured or your pricing or was it just building up that base of clients and expertise and case studies and testimonials mixed together?  

Alex:    00:57:55    What I honestly think it was, and this is gonna sound funny cuz it shouldn't matter, but I really think it's how transparent I was with my image because Fiverr is anonymous so there's all these people on there with no pictures on their profile. It looks really sketchy, you don't know who they are, are they gonna scam you or are they lying about who they say they are? And I've kind of always had no shame with just coming on social media and like here I am, like I don't edit out like scars on my face or anything. I'm just like, I'm a human. This is what I look like by like I've never cared basically and I've never had like a hold up on like being afraid to be seen online. So I do a lot of coaching with people on that. We were very scared to be seen online and I kind of helped them get through whatever mindset blocks is causing it.  

Alex:    00:58:38    But I just came right out on Fiverr. I had like 18 different pictures of me all over my profile. I had all these paragraphs about like who I am instead of trying to sound so corporate. I was just like, Hi, I'm Alex, I'm 22, I'm brand new to this. I wanna help you. I have red hair and a cat and that's it. You know? And I was just candidly myself and very transparent about what I am and what I'm not. And I think it won over people's trust just quickly cuz it's a human talking to a human. And so many people buy into like the anonymity or they get all weird online and they lurk and they watch people's stuff but they never post their own cuz they're afraid someone might notice their eyebrows crooked or something, you know, it's like <laugh>, you have have to just like throw that stuff out the window. You gotta kind of humble yourself almost and just get on there and be like, here I am, take it or leave it. And the second you open up like that, they flood in. I swear they can energetically sense your openness and your transparency.  

Kristin:    00:59:35    Yeah, that's good advice because sometimes I see people on LinkedIn and they look like kind of human robots, corporate robots and I can't tell who they are as people, but everyone connects with people whether it's in person or on social media or in a movie. You connect with the humanity of the people. And so that's great advice. What do you think is the biggest mistake that people make when they start out?  

Alex:    01:00:01    Probably the imagery, the transparency thing. The coaching I've done with people, they'll upload a picture to their profile, right? And it's like you only have like three pictures as a chance to connect with this other human. So it better be a picture of you up close with your eyes wide open, your teeth like smiling, happy. Okay. And these people will upload these pictures where they're just like lurking like this where they have sunglasses on <laugh> and I'm like, how do you expect someone to want to buy from you? Like you need to look happy, you need to be excited about this. So I would say it's probably that mixed with just a lack of time management awareness. So it's like if someone books an order with you on Fiverr, you have a timer and if you deliver that order late, it penalizes your profile naturally. So once you set the timer, you gotta turn on your notifications. Cuz if someone booked something with you, you have to get it done. And if you miss, you know, your first five orders, then they'll come say to me, oh, I missed the first five and now five are kick me off. I'm like, well yeah, five of their clients, you know, you gotta step up here. There's no boss that's gonna pick up the phone and and yell to you anymore. You have to kind of take responsibility or accountability for the life you want. You have to show up for it.  

Kristin:    01:01:11    Yeah, definitely. That kind of goes along with what we were talking about earlier in the conversation, that it's not easy, but you still have to show up and do the work. And if you just do one gig on time every time, then that's gonna add up really quickly. Last question, what advice would you have for yourself in that first year where you netted $33,000 or gross $33,000  

Alex:    01:01:38    You? What I struggled with the most when I was first starting was taking criticism personally because writing is an artistic output isn't everything though. And I hadn't learned the separation between myself as a human and the output that I was making. I was considering them to be one and the same. So if I gave someone a press release, they told me it was terrible. I took personal offense to that and it caused me to be snippy with some people. I got a few account warnings, I was kind of outta line, probably a little sassy, a little temporary. And over time now me at the ripe old age of 29, I totally recognize there's a huge separation between me as a person and the content I put online. And coming to that realization has been so amazing and on a happiness level for my health for everything else. But I think I would say to myself, don't take anything personally, it's just business. You know that press release you wrote is not you. And if they have some critiques, they might be kind of valid if you can calm down and listen to what they're saying. <laugh>.  

Kristin:    01:02:41    Yeah, that's such great advice. You're so wise for your young years, so definitely an old soul.  

Alex:    01:02:48    Oh my God. Yeah.  

Kristin:    01:02:49    Thanks so much for coming on today, Alex. And where can people find more of your content and follow you?  

Alex:    01:02:55    Sure. So if you can find me as Alexandra Fasulo on every single social media app at this point, and I have a website and my biggest push is yeah, this book, my whole life is in it. This is like such a dark joke. Sorry. I say like, I hope I don't die next year. Cause now people say like when they do their life's work, then like it's complete. Like that's how I feel like this book out. It's like complete. It's my life's work.  

Kristin:    01:03:17    This is the coming full circle of the first phase of your life. This is you teaching and getting closure on this phase of your life so that you can then write the next book because that's how life works. You just  do  the next thing.  

Alex:    01:03:33    Isn't that actually astrological? Don't they say a 29 like your Saturn comes back or something.  

Kristin:    01:03:38    It's a Saturn return thing or something. I forget at which ages it's at, but yeah.  

Alex:    01:03:44    Yeah, yeah. No, thank you for having me on, Kristin. This has been super fun.  

Kristin:    01:03:48    Okay, hope to see you on Florida or Scotland soon.  

Alex:    01:03:51    Yes, perfect.  

Kristin:    01:03:55    I hope you enjoyed today's conversation with Alex. If so, please leave us a review wherever you listen, and if you've been thinking about becoming a freelancer or independent contractor someday, then make sure to pick up a copy of Alex's book, linked in the show notes or by checking out my online course, Freelance to Freedom at digitalnomadbootcamp.com.