How to Pay Less Taxes and Move to Europe with James Meads of Live Work Germany

Introduction: Welcome to Badass Digital Nomads, where we're pushing the boundaries of remote work and travel, all while staying grounded with a little bit of old school philosophy, self-development, and business advice from our guests.

Kristin:    You know, critics of remote work say that you need meetings and face-to-face interaction in order to get things done. But we all know that communication and community are two of the most important factors for success in a location independent lifestyle. So every time you listen to an episode of this or any podcast that you find value in, I challenge you to share the wealth. Take a moment to think of one person in your professional or personal network who might benefit from listening in. Then share it with them and tell them why. Doing this will help you absorb and apply the info that most resonated with you from the episode, putting it into practice in your own life while delivering value to someone you care about. And with that, let's get on with today's show,  

James:    00:01:26    <laugh> 

Kristin:    00:01:27    So, okay. Our stream today is happening on a Thursday instead of a Tuesday, and it is with James Meads, who's originally from the UK, but he is coming to us live from Sophia, Bulgaria. So one of my favorite countries. We're gonna ask him what the heck he's doing over there. So he's from the uk, but he's spent actually 12 years living in Germany. During that time. He's had three corporate jobs. He bought two properties, sold one, got a mortgage, filed his taxes, was a tenant, was a landlord, started his own business abroad, and experienced and learned all about the German culture and what makes the country tick. So now James has a company called Live Work Germany, where he helps people move abroad, very similar to my line of work, actually. And he helps people move to anywhere in Germany and kind of the real Germany, the local Germany that is outside just the Berlin expat bubble.  

Kristin:    00:02:32    And at the end of last year, he quit his high paying corporate job, and he officially became a digital nomad. So now he's location independent, he can live all around the world, and he does, we're gonna talk to him a little bit about his travel and his real estate ventures abroad. And now he's helping people through his free content on YouTube and also through his company. He has a free offer for you guys if you're interested in moving to Germany. And we're gonna talk about why he's exploring Eastern Europe as a possible destination for his home base for tax and cost of living reasons. And James and I met in London in his old stomping ground. So without further ado, let's bring on James Meads. Welcome James. 

Podcast Interview: 

James:    00:03:20    Thanks, Kristin. Hi, good afternoon or good morning, wherever you are in the world. Yeah, <laugh>.  

Kristin:    00:03:24    Yeah, so I'll, I'll set the scene a little bit. I am in Florida right now, and as I just went to my storage unit and cleaned it out after two years, I found this amazing mug here. This is actually from my trip to Santorini, Greece to Oia, which I used to pronounce wrongly. I used to call it Oya, but Rolf Potts kindly let me know that it's pronounced Oya. And so I'm just sipping some coffee. It's still basically morning. It's 10:30 over here. And what time is it over in Bulgaria?  

James:    00:03:57    It's about six 30 in the evening. And yeah, I went to Santorini, God, when was it? About 2001, 2002. So yeah, it feels like a very long time ago. But yeah, it's a beautiful part of the world. Yeah.  

Kristin:    00:04:08    Oh my God. So you went to Santorini before Instagram. What was that like? Was it crowded, or what time of year did you go there?  

James:    00:04:16    I think, I think I'm the only person in the world that still doesn't use Instagram, so <laugh>. Um, but yeah, it was, uh, it was, it was definitely not full of people posting photos for social media. That's sure. But, um, yeah, it was still a lot of tourists back then, but I guess it's just exploded even more so now because it's just such a photogenic place and with Ryanair and EasyJet, and it's so easy to get there now compared to what it used to be with having to take ferries from the mainland. So yeah, I, I guess it's a lot different. I had a great time while I was there though. I went island hopping and went to, went to iOS and went to Naxos and Crete and yeah, Greece is fantastic.  

Kristin:    00:04:57    Oh my God. It is. And the food is so good. We actually had Jason Pino, who's Australian, but has dual citizenship also in Europe, and he's in Greece, and we were just talking about the food, and I was reminiscing about that, the food and the coffee. But yeah, in 2001, 2002, it would've been pretty difficult to, uh, live there and run a remote business well, from anywhere really, unless you had the satellite internet and you owned Amazon probably, I think that was even pre-Amazon, I don't know. But so how did you end up moving from the UK to Germany? How did that all come about?  

James:    00:05:34    Yeah, I, I spent a year in Germany when I was a student, so I could, uh, I could already speak German when I went. Uh, and yeah, it was at the point I was 28. All of my friends were buying houses and getting married and doing all those things that most people do when they're in their late twenties. And, and I looked around and wasn't really that happy in my job and couldn't really see myself settling down in, in the city I was living in, in the UK. And I really just put a few feelers out and, and applied for a few jobs. I applied for one in Prague, I applied for one in Vienna, and then this job came up in, in BVWD and in Germany that the, the description of the job fitted pretty much exactly what was, what was on my cv.  

James:    00:06:18    So it was, it was just a, a golden opportunity at the time that perfectly matched my experience and what they were looking for. And, uh, as it became apparent at the time, they were, they were pretty keen to get people recruited and onboarded, which gave me a little bit of negotiating room on salary. So in the end, it was really a no brainer. And I thought, yeah, you know, I'll go over there for two or three years, see what it's like, and then if I wanna come back, I always can, you know, nothing ventured. It will be a good experience. And yeah, ended up staying for 12 years and doing three different jobs while I was out there and, uh, whole lot of other experiences. So, um, yeah, it was, uh, definitely the right move at the time. I'm glad I did it.  

Kristin:    00:06:59    Well, that's amazing. And I always tell people that you'll never regret moving abroad. Like even if the worst case scenario happens and things crash and burn and you get fired and lose all of your money or whatever, I've never had anyone say like, I wish I didn't go, or I wish I didn't try it. And I've worked with poker players, so a lot of times they do <laugh>, not a lot of times, but sometimes they do lose a lot of money and then they go back. But they all say that it's like a great experience. So what, what was your background that gave you the qualifications for a job? Can you give us some insight into what kind of work experience or what you studied and what you had that helped you get this job in another country? Yeah.  

James:    00:07:45    I, my, my degree really was not particularly relevant. I studied, I studied modern languages and politics, so, uh, it wasn't really relevant to what I ended up landing, landing doing as a career. But my, my background, my work experience was in, in strategic procurement, uh, in the automotive industry. So I started out as a graduate trainee for Jaguar Land Rover or, or Jaguar as, as Americans call it, <laugh> <laugh>. Um, and, and then after that I worked for one of their suppliers. And the job that I ended up doing in Germany that I moved out to Germany for wa was for a big tier one automotive parts supplier. And they were centralizing their global purchasing departments in, in Detroit, in North America, in VBar, in Germany, and in Shanghai and China. And a lot of people that they had within their organization that were working in the different countries in the different manufacturing plants, didn't really want to relocate to Germany to be part of this central team because, you know, they had houses, they had families, they had their lives in their countries.  

James:    00:08:52    So what ended up happening was over a, a course of about two years was that the company pretty much recruited a whole new department as, as people then left the company as it become, became more and more centralized. So I, I was the first one that came on board, but by the time I left that job four years later, we had a whole office, pretty much of expats. So <laugh>, yeah, it was, uh, it was, it was good fun in terms of making friends and meeting people that were in a similar situation and that wanted to socialize. So it was, it was great in that sense.  

Kristin:    00:09:25    And what are some of the perks that companies offer expats when they move abroad? Because this is actually something that I've talked about in some of my workshops and talks at different digital nomad events because I actually studied human resources and international management in college. So we learned a lot about executive and employee relocations and all of the challenges that come along with it. This was pre-digital nomads. I mean, this was like 2002 to 2005. And now when I talk about that, I, I talk about all of the like cushy perks and salary and benefits and financial incentives that people get to move, but mostly the people who are moving for corporate reasons don't necessarily want to, as you mentioned, because they have jobs, because they have families, because they have houses. And then on the other hand, we have digital nomads or people who work for themselves or work remotely who want to travel and want to move around, but they don't have the financial backing or resources to do it. So can you kind of talk about what that was like for you and some of your colleagues when you moved with a corporation kind of there for financial and moral support and then what it was like when you decided to do it on your own?  

James:    00:10:50    Yeah, I mean, I think there's a, there is a bit of a myth out there in terms of, in terms of expat packages, and I think you touched on it, Kristin, that back in the day, back in, you know, the early two thousands when companies still made a lot of money and it was quite the norm to, to send people from head office all over the world to sort out problems, then yeah, companies did tend to offer pretty cushy expat packages, especially, especially if it was for existing staff that they were sending on assignments somewhere. I mean, my situation was a little bit different in that I, I, I was recruited into that role externally, and I was on a local contract from the start. So I wasn't employed as a UK expat working in Germany. I was on a local German contract, but, but yeah, I got, I got assistance with relocation and they put me in touch with a couple of estate agencies to, to help me find an apartment, and they paid for my removal costs, but they didn't really do anything over and above that.  

James:    00:11:47    And, and one of the things, I mean, I guess we'll touch on that a bit later if we're talking about what I've done with my, my business in Germany. But one of the things when people come into jobs as foreigners in a new country, whether they're on expat contracts or, or whether they, whether they just move to work abroad, is that HR departments will often pay a relocation allowance. But really the relocation process, in my opinion, starts when you move into your new apartment. Whereas most HR departments tend to think that their job is done then, and that's, that's <laugh> it's, it's almost the start. I mean, they're, they're not there when you get your first speeding ticket or, or when you, when, when, when you don't understand the contract that you've begin being given to sign or, or when you need to figure out health insurance or when you have a dispute with your landlord and all that, all that kind of lovely stuff.  

James:    00:12:39    So there is a bit of a disconnect in terms of what, what HR considers relocation and, and what it really entails when you actually do it. But yeah, obviously it's, it's easier to some extent when you do it working for a company because to some extent they've got your back. Whereas when you're doing it as a digital nomad or a remote remotely located worker, then you're kind of on your own. But then at the same time, you've got a little bit more flexibility as well in that, you know, you don't have to juggle relocation with going, going into the office from eight, eight o'clock till five o'clock every day and not having any time to, to do your own personal admin. So I guess there's kind of pros and cons on both sides.  

Kristin:    00:13:20    Yeah, and I think that with expats, especially if they're moving with families, then it's kind of like what to do with the kids, what to do with the significant other, and usually the significant other gets, uh, bored or has to change their career or gets frustrated because they don't wanna be moving. Whereas with digital nomads, many of us are individuals, some couples, some families, but we're all like moving because we, we wanted to move, but you make some really good points because I actually wanted to, maybe we can get into this now because I wanted to touch on it during the interview. Both you and I kind of learned, not kind of, we did, we learned on our own what it is like to live in a foreign country. And I started in college studying abroad and as a surfer living in different countries and competing, and then just kind of snowballed from there.  

Kristin:    00:14:14    And you learned going to Germany, it was kind of like sink or swim. And after 10 years or so, you get so much experience that we became, we literally became relocation companies helping other people and looking at what those corporate companies are doing right, and what they're doing wrong and where the holes are. And a lot of my corporate friends have said that they were given a lot of money and a lot of support through a relocation company, and then they ended up doing it on their own anyway. And so what I've tried to do is help people, like I put a one month, two month, three month, like follow ups with new information because usually people are adjusting once they get there and they're kind of going through that expat roller coaster of like, this is great, everything's cool, we can drink beer and, you know, eat like sausages in Germany and like, this is awesome.  

Kristin:    00:15:10    And then, you know, a few weeks later it's like you said, you get a speeding ticket or something happens and then you don't know what to do. And, and so there's always these phases that you need to have support, whether it's from somebody who you're paying for help or through the expat community. So can you talk about what some of the things are that your clients struggle with when they are moving to a new country and what you help them with after having, you know, lived there for 12 years and some of the things that you can anticipate that they're going to experience or that are gonna go wrong at some point?  

James:    00:15:52    Yeah, I mean it's, it's, it's interesting because when I, when I set it up, the expectation that I had of how it would develop as a business is completely different to the sort of route I've gone down for, for a number of reasons. But yeah, I, I kind of expected to be helping, I mean, my avatar typically my avatar when I set it up was typically people between sort of around 25 and 40, so sort of youngish professionals that are, that have a good job but are not, but are not necessarily sort of director or executive level. So they're moving over to get a good well paid position, but they're probably not in the salary bracket that's gonna give them a one-on-one sort of concierge service to, to do pretty much everything for them. And, and there is an argument to be made that, you know, if you don't have kids and you're not relocating pets and a family and a whole house, you don't necessarily need a sort of full, full on hands on relocation company as long as you've got someone in the background that's got your back.  

James:    00:16:51    And that was kind of what I envisaged to sort of help people through that process and get them set up and to educate them around, you know, what to look out for with a rental contract, how to get, how to get a sim card, how to, how to register their car, how, how to do all the typical things that you generally have to deal with with the relocation. But what I found was that once I'd started, once I got a few blog articles on the website, and once I started getting some love from Google, which typically it took about six months before I started ranking for some of the articles that I had on the site, a lot of the questions that I tended to get were, can you help me with finding a job? Or can you help me with visa info? Or can you give me some tips around, you know, whether my qualification and level of experience will make it easy for me to find work in, in Germany.  

James:    00:17:42    So what I thought would be a good business in terms of helping people get set up once they move there, because one of the things about Germany is, number one, it's very bureaucratic, uh, and number two is professional services in Germany are ridiculously expensive and customer service is zero <laugh>. So, so those things was kind of my business model. I thought I can be like a friendly, helpful person at an affordable price that's not charging premium rates because I don't have an office, I don't have all of the overhead, blah, blah, blah. But what I found was that most of the inquiries I was getting, and I mean, I put, I put a, I put a widget on the website to allow people to, to get a free 10 minute consultation. And well, I didn't really earn much money from that. What I found was it gave me a lot more understanding of what people's problems were that were coming to the site.  

James:    00:18:31    And uh, I would say probably 80% of the questions were, can you help me with finding a job? Or can you help me with visas? Or can you help me expla- help explain the immigration process to me? And that then sort of led me down the route of how would I wanna structure my business knowing that's what most of the people coming to the site, or at least the ones that are engaging with the content want to know about. So my most recent task was kind of splitting the site in two. So as from the homepage, it really directs visitors down two separate, separate pipelines or funnels to say, well, are you still in the process of planning your move or are you already in Germany and are looking for advice or support on a specific problem? And on the second part, so if for people that are already there, I've kind of gone down the route there of working with partners that can help solve those problems.  

James:    00:19:24    If there's an English speaking service provider or an English speaking website or a company that's particularly innovative and flexible in the contracts that they offer, then I'm funneling people towards those products and I just earn a commission from them. And, and in that way I'm, I'm helping people to get a products or a service that I'd be happy with using myself or recommend myself or even that I've used myself. And at the same time making sure that the, that, that the customer's getting something from it and that, you know, they don't have to deal with a 10 page contract in German that they can't get out of for two years. Uh, and then on the, on the sort of left hand side of the website with people that are still planning a move, that's where I'm offering my own services there in terms of giving expertise around the immigration and visa system and the job application process, how to put together a German style CV and cover letter. Uh, because that's where I think that I can really add value to my audience. And that's ultimately what I'm working on now to get online courses out there to, to solve those problems without me having to, to essentially do the same work individually. One-on-one for every person that asks me that question,  

Kristin:    00:20:33    I'm in like literally the same position because I was just talking about this yesterday in the car, like talking about how long it would take to actually put, you know, your knowledge into a informational product or into an online course. And it is valuable because these are the things that over time we learned, but it's like, what is the value to somebody new who hasn't moved to that country yet, or who hasn't gotten a job abroad that do they wanna spend 10 years trying to figure out what is the best way to do everything? No, they would like to know today what is the best way to do it and how to avoid those mistakes. So I think that that's, that's really important. And it's like if you're starting a new business and you're specializing in one thing, you know, for anyone watching or listening, you don't necessarily need to become an expert at every single functional area of the business.  

Kristin:    00:21:28    Like, I don't know how to program or do graphic design or things like that. Like you wanna outsource that, you wanna hire out, you wanna delegate. And it's the same with an international move. Like sure, you could read the entire internet and try to decipher between the information and what's outdated and what's current and what's accurate and dependable, or you could just ask an expert and that's it. And you know, people like you and I, we have our thumb on the pulse of these kinds of things and we're always looking for the best way, uh, to do something. So it's like when it comes to finding a rental property or answering a, a question that seems very simple on the surface, but when you're moving to a new country, you have to find out the best way to do everything the first time, and it's impossible to do it correctly.  

Kristin:    00:22:15    So is it just either a matter of trial and error or finding somebody who's an expert in that exact area of expertise? So I think that's, um, yeah, I had a, a friend ask me this week, she's like, well, why are you, you know, helping digital nomads? Why don't you just keep helping the poker players? And I'm like, because I can only help one person at a time, and there's definitely a way to, to package this type of information that it can reach more people. So it's like, yeah, I can go another eight years just helping people one-on-one, or I could publish this information on YouTube and like make it available to everybody. So that eliminates those, those pain points that, that we had <laugh> back when the internet wasn't so, uh, you know, prolific,  

James:    00:23:04    Right? And I mean, if if somebody really, really wants to, they can, they can get that information for free. And they may, they may fail a couple of times and they may make some mistakes on the way, but it's, it's out there. But I guess with any sort of online service or any professional service in general, you're paying for convenience. It's a bit like doing a tax return, you know, could, could most people model through it and do it. Sure. Unless, unless you've got a complex business set up. But do most people want to? No. You know, it's what an accountant does really is not rocket science for the average one person business, but not many people submit their own accounts. And it's kind of the same argument with relocation or with immigration services, I guess, isn't it?  

Kristin:    00:23:46    Exactly. And it's interesting with this business model specifically, because there's so much overlap between, uh, your personal life, your professional life. It's like both of us actually we're walking the talk and you are in Eastern Europe right now, which is a place where I've been myself and I've made a lot of videos about it and I've been exploring and studying and researching over there. So do you wanna talk a little bit about why you moved from western Europe into Eastern Europe and kind of what you're looking for over there? Why are you in countries like Bulgaria and Romania and what are your intentions with this on the ground research?  

James:    00:24:29    Yeah, sure. So I mean, in a nutshell, when when I, when I set up Live Work Germany as a business or as a website, I always had in mind that I wanted it to be a, a remote business. Because even at the time with planning to stay in Germany at the time, I always wanted to have the option that I could get away at the winter because Germany's a wonderful place to live in a lot of ways. But the one thing that really got me down was the winter, very cold, very gray, very dark. Uh, and I, and I thought, you know, if I have my, if I have my own business where I'm remotely located, you know, I can go and spend the winter in Cape Town or somewhere and uh, and and, and just enjoy the warm weather. Ultimately what, I mean, what, what happened was I realized pretty soon that if I could run my business remotely, then for a whole multitude of reasons, I don't really need to be located in Germany.  

James:    00:25:25    And it's actually probably gonna be more favorable if I'm not, I mean, Germany is a fantastic place to be an employee, you know, 30, 30 days paid holiday, 30 days, paid holiday holidays, salaries are really good. There's a very comprehensive social safety net. If you fall on hard times, quality of life is really good. You know, it's, um, cost of housing and cost of living relative to, uh, relative to salaries is, is pretty favorable, especially if you compare it to some, somewhere like the uk it has a lot going for it in many ways. But to run a business from there is, is tough. I mean, Germany is definitely not business friendly. Taxes are very high. There's a lot of bureaucracy, professional services like lawyers, tax advisors, bookkeepers are all incredibly expensive. And I just thought, why, you know, I can, as long as I'm running my business remotely and it o over time, it's not gonna be my main source of income anyway.  

James:    00:26:23    I mean, it will, my goal is to have my online business paying my bills and my living costs and being able to pay my day-to-day expenses and my rent or my mortgage or whatever. But it, it could kind of then run itself if I'm, if I'm selling online courses, uh, especially if I can get an assistant or a web master part-time to look after it. And I'd been to Eastern Europe before I kind of, the, the cost of living is, is a lot lower out here. The scenery is beautiful. I, I ski and there's lots of mountains out here, so I like the food, food out in Eastern Europe's really nice. And what I found after I started looking into it was just how favorable the whole tax setup is in, uh, not just, I mean, Bulgaria and Romania are probably the most well known for it, especially among the digital nomad community, but also places outside of the EU like Serbia and Montenegro and Georgia are pretty favorable, uh, Estonia in some instances as well.  

James:    00:27:20    So yeah, that kind of, that kind of got me thinking, you know, I don't necessarily need to be in Germany, so where do I wanna locate myself? And, um, this trip after, after spending the first few months of this year, just signed a, just, uh, kind of getting things together and knuckling down. I spent the first few months in Spain. Uh, I have a holiday home in and Lucia. So, uh, I spent the first few months of this year out there, which is nice. Yeah. And, and then once, uh, once July rolled on, I thought, right, I better better start, uh, doing a bit of research and trying to figure out where I want to base myself a bit more permanently because, uh, I mean I'm, I'm 41, you know, I'm not in my twenties, so the appeal of jumping from city to city every few weeks is not really a thing for me. You know, I want a home, I wanna put down some roots, I wanna build up some professional contacts as well in terms of network and, and, and, and sort of business contacts. Yeah, I think Romania or I'm tending probably more towards Bulgaria is a really good place to do that. And that's what I'm doing at the moment.  

Kristin:    00:28:26    That's amazing, James. You're living your best life. So I'll just make it a little bit of a distinction for the US listeners and viewers versus non-US. So I personally am very jealous of this situation because the US is one of only two countries in the world where we are not able to change our personal tax domicile. So we're based on citizen, we're taxed based on citizenship, whereas people from pretty much any other country in the world, uh, save Eritrea, are taxed on their country of residence. So their country of physical presence. And so as a British citizen or a German citizen or from anywhere, if you move outside of the country, you can actually change your tax base to the country where you're living, which makes logical sense, obviously. Whereas US citizens, we can get some kinds of tax breaks by living abroad. We can never reduce our taxable income by like 10, 20, 30%, or, well, I don't wanna give specific numbers, but just as a comparative reference, the tax rate in Bulgaria, I believe is 10% on income tax and corporate tax.  

Kristin:    00:29:45    But, um, without renouncing your US citizenship, you can't, um, really that doesn't give you much of an individual benefit. So I could go and live in Bulgaria and register to pay taxes there, but it's going to have a much different impact on my personal balance sheet versus somebody who is from another country. So there's a lot of people from the UK actually living in Bulgaria, I think for that reason, for the combination of the low cost of living, the high quality of life, the many activities and sports and things like that. And they can also lower their individual income tax liability. So there's a lot of people from the Netherlands and other high tax countries living out there. And yeah, that's basically not an option for somebody like me, but, and what did you find is the, uh, the situation in Romania? Because I know that that's another low tax, low cost of living destination.  

James:    00:30:47    Yeah, so the, well, Romania is actually more favorable in some ways than Bulgaria with, with a little proviso in there. So if you run a business that doesn't have much overhead, so if you are a solopreneur that maybe spends a few hundred dollars a month on SaaS subscriptions and maybe you've got a part-time, va, you know, if you've got a, if you've got a relatively low overhead business, then for tax purposes, Romania is probably, in most cases gonna be a better option because Romania has what they call a micro company. And if your annual turnover is below 1 million euro, you actually only pay 3% corporation tax. But it's on, but it's on sales, it's on turnover rather than profit. So the advantage there is if you've got a business with low expenses and with low overhead, you know, if you've not got much capital tied up in your business, if you've not got much inventory, then Romania is actually probably in most cases gonna be a better option.  

James:    00:31:45    And I mean, I loved Romania while I was there. The only thing that's sort of tipping me a little bit more towards Bulgaria is I think in terms of business networking and opportunities, there's probably more in Bulgaria than in Romania in in what I'm doing or looking to do. That's my personal opinion, it's not fact. But um, and the other thing is, I mean, if you're gonna be based out of a capital city, I personally found Bucharest to be a pretty drab ugly city, great nightlife, great bars, great, uh, <laugh>, great coffee shops, but, but I found Bucharest to be quite an ugly city, whereas Sophia, I actually think is really nice. You've got, you've got the mountains in the background and it's a very green, there's a lot of parks and yeah, iv, which is another city that I'm looking at is only, is only two hours away from, uh, from Sophia.  

James:    00:32:35    So if I, if I decided to locate there for example, then I'm still only a, only a day, only a train ride in the morning and back in the evening away from being able to network or, or go to meetings. So yeah, that's, that's just pure personal opinion, but maybe food for thought for anyone that's thinking about making the same move. And it was even made something that I'd got in the back of my mind, I need to research it a bit more, but I've already registered the domain names to, to actually aim a business at people that, that run maybe e-commerce businesses or businesses with low overheads and that are location independent that, that maybe wanna set up out here because, uh, you know, you touched on it, Kristin, as long as you're not a US citizen, it's a pretty favorable setup and relatively easy to do and you don't necessarily need to give up where you are physically located. You can set up a company out here and just put all of your sales through the company here, and then I'm not a tax advisor, but you can, you can reduce your tax burden by doing that even without relocating in some cases  

Kristin:    00:33:36    And having a, an affordable home base as somebody who, you know, wants a home, especially in our age group, <laugh>, uh, you know, we're not spring chickens anymore. I  

James:    00:33:48    Say, yeah, you are younger than me, but yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, it is, I mean, we joke about it, but it is, it is a factor, and I know you've touched a lot about this on your, on your channel and in your, in your Facebook group, but there is this myth that digital nomads are just, uh, longhaired 20 somethings that are, that, that, that are sat out in Bali or in, or or in Thailand and, and, and living the life on the beach. But yeah, there are a lot of people that are older and that are maybe not in the, in the traditional sort of expected life path of, of Mortgage House and kids and, and, and marriage that, that, that do want a more permanent base. And yeah, certainly Eastern Europe, not just Bulgarian or Roman Romania, but a lot of countries, I mean Czech Republic, Hungary, and maybe other ones that, that have a lower cost of living and a really good quality of life and that can offer that.  

James:    00:34:37    And um, yeah, I guess for most anyone that's anyone that's in their sort of thirties or forties that's built up maybe a bit of equity through owning property in the past or selling a business could probably pretty easily afford to buy a property out here cash that would be perfectly adequate for what they need if they just want, you know, a one or two bedroom flat as a, as a base and somewhere that feels like home to, to base themselves out of even while maybe traveling two or three months a year, which is probably what my plan's gonna be.  

Kristin:    00:35:06    Definitely. And for anyone who isn't familiar with the cost of living in Eastern Europe, and I don't wanna group them into just, you know, just lump them into one group, but the cost of living is significantly lower in like the Balkans in Eastern Europe compared to Western Europe. So consider for example, and if you want, I have a lot of videos on my channel about the cost of living over there and rent, and specifically my apartment that was 150 euro per month, including utilities. So I mean, consider that for less than the cost of a nightly hotel room. You can have a home base in Eastern Europe for the same cost per month. And if you can do that and then you can rent your place out when you're not there, you can have a really affordable home base with all in, let's say you're keeping your costs at 500 euro per month or to be generous a thousand euro per month, and then you're located regionally in a place that you have access to great direct international flights to the Middle East, to Europe, to Africa, to Asia, you're cutting out probably one layover in hours of flight time when you're departing from Eastern Europe versus Lisbon, Portugal, for example.  

Kristin:    00:36:26    What a pain in the ass that <laugh> that would be. I actually think the Lisbon airport is not the best for international flights. I think we're gonna see over the next few years a lot of services, maybe people like James and I are gonna going to be offering them because you do need certain basic knowledge. You need to know what the housing prices are, what the comps are, which lawyer to use to do your paperwork and your residency, how to get healthcare, how to file to pay taxes, how to set up a company. And there are very few people doing that. I know Nomad Capitalist is doing that for some people around the world, but there's gonna be a huge demand for these sorts of things because you're right, James, not everybody wants to be a digital backpacker. Some of us digital nomads wanna have a home base without having to spend a ton of money when we're not there.  

Kristin:    00:37:17    So I think we'll see a lot more co-living, a lot more house sharing, a lot more Airbnb of, um, of properties around there. And also for people listening, you can purchase, for example, a one bedroom apartment for anywhere from like 20,000 to 50,000 euro in a country like Bulgaria. So that's basically the cost of a down payment on a house in a lot of places. So it might make sense to rent a long-term contract, it might make sense to buy something, but for anybody from a non-US company, and again, we're not tax advisors, but if you have the ability to legally reduce your personal tax burden while living a life of freedom and location independence, then why wouldn't you so food for thought. Absolutely, yes. So let's talk about a little bit how you and I met because we met in London last year in November, was it November at the Youpreneur Summit in London?  

Kristin:    00:38:17    And I wanted to talk about this because it's such a good example of how you can network as a digital nomad and what can happen when you're intentional about it. Because I was a, a nomad or living abroad for like over 10 years before I met another digital nomad. And it wasn't until I made the decision, like I wanna expand my network that it started happening. So I started attending conferences and reaching out to people online, and then here we are sitting here having this chat. So what is the Entrepreneur conference and why did you go to it and what did you learn? Uh,  

James:    00:38:50    I actually, yeah, I actually went in 2017 to the inaugural one, so I'd been, I'd been following Chris Docker, the guy who runs it. I'd been listening to his podcast and, uh, and consuming his content. And, uh, I was, uh, I was really just at the start of setting up my, my website when, when the first Eist summit was announced, and I was actually on secondment with my corporate job, a hold up in the Radisson Hotel in Lagos, Nigeria for three months. That's some stories I could tell you about that. And, uh, I got an email from Chris Ducker saying, I'm putting on this event in London, it's gonna be epic pre-register now and get a special price. I mean, I think it was 400 pounds. I'd been sat in this hotel for the best part of two months at the time, and I'd spent no money because I was on a daily allowance from my employer.  

James:    00:39:39    So I thought, can I swear? Yeah, I just thought fuck it and paid the money and said, okay, I'll go. I, I'm still very much in the, in, in the early phases of setting up my business, but I'll go and it'd be great because hopefully I'll meet like-minded people and if I'm stepping up my game and meeting people that are further down the line than me, then it will be a great sort of impetus to sort of fire me up and, and keep me going. And I, I'm so glad that I did it. I mean, we, we met the following year. We met last year in 2018, but yeah, so 2017 was the first one and it was, it was fantastic. I'd, uh, when I got there, I think I'd had about four hours sleep the night before because I'd literally just flown back from Johannesburg from a work trip, um, and then hopped on another flight then from Frankfurt to London and, uh, and yeah, just jump straight into this, my first sort of online business conference.  

James:    00:40:31    But, uh, it's an awesome event. The people were really friendly, very, very open, the way that it's set up that you are just completely randomly on another table with about eight other people, I think it is, it's just really conducive to be able to start conversations with similar minded people, but doing stuff in completely different avenues, but you can nonetheless learn from them. And, and I thought that was, that was really good that even, even though someone's maybe doing a completely different business, you can still take a lot of learning from them. Yeah, I mean, an example to, I was, I was on a table with, uh, with, with a lady that has a business teaching people how to be, how to be DJs and how to be better DJs, <laugh>, that's, that's their online business. That's  

Kristin:    00:41:19    Awesome. That's a huge business. Yeah.  

James:    00:41:22    But I, I learned so much from her just around how she goes about doing Facebook ads and how she manages her VAs out in the Philippines. And even though it's a completely different business, it was, uh, it was a really interesting conversation. And likewise, when we, when we had the round table, I, I gave her a lot of really good insights around, she was having problems with one of her employees that wanted to go remote, uh, and she didn't really want to let him go 100% remotely located. Um, just from my corporate job as a buyer, I just said, well, this is a negotiation. You know, you have to just map out, you know, do you have the stronger position or do they, uh, and what are the points that you're willing to trade and what are your red lines? And then if you've got that, then you'll understand a lot more around, you know, who's wearing the trousers in the negotiation and whether you can approach it from a more dominant standpoint or a more conciliatory standpoint. And yeah, it's really good how those sort of business exchanges can happen in just in niches that are completely different. And Youpreneur is great for that.  

Kristin:    00:42:25    Yeah, there's something about this remote work revolution where people are collaborating more than competing because we realize that it's not a zero sum game. So everybody's just sharing information and what would be known in the past as spying or reconnaissance or something like that is now simply the way it is. People have open source programming and business models and revenue, they're sharing like everything and coming together, whether it's remotely through a Facebook group or at a conference or a mastermind or anything with other people who share one thing in common. And that is wanting to work for themselves or be location independent and then having businesses in all different industries. I mean, that's a way that everybody can level up quickly and learn from each other and you know, 'cause we're just inventing this as we go, you know, there's no roadmap for this. So everybody's sharing information, whether it's from a drop shipping store or teaching people how to DJ or learning a language online or whatever type of product or service that you're selling. I think it's really important for everybody listening to try to find some other people that share in that mindset, because chances are the people around you aren't necessarily going to understand. So it doesn't matter where you are in the world, try to find your tribe and try to find other people who get it and who are encouraging you and who are, who are there to help you because they know that you success is better for everybody.  

James:    00:44:02    De definitely. And just, yeah, so, so many tips and great pieces of advice and just the network and the conversations that you get from going to these events. I mean, if you're based in the States, I mean, there's a whole lot more in, in, in the us but, but just the, the inspiration and the, and the ideas that you get from speaking to these people. One, one guy, that one guy that I met there last year at Renu said, uh, it's an expensive trip to the pub, but it's a really worthwhile, uh, thing to do. So <laugh>, yes,  

Kristin:    00:44:32    <laugh>, all business happens in the pub when you're in London, that's for sure. <laugh>. Oh my God. Okay. I've got some lightning round questions for you, James. I feel like we're gonna need to do a follow up. Maybe we'll do it in person with beer in like Romania or Bulgaria and talk about some of your travel stories, because I know you have a lot of them. But for today we'll just do four or five quick questions here. What is one productivity tip that you have?  

James:    00:45:03    Okay, the, one of the, the one that I've probably got the most from in terms of getting stuff done is to, instead of just writing down a to-do list, I actually now write things into a quadrant. So I split a piece of, I split a paper into four quarters and I prioritize my tasks based on low efforts and high impact first of all. And then I work my way down. So low effort, low impact, high effort, high impact, and then right the way down to the bottom, which are the, the lowest, lowest priority ones are high effort and low impact. I think that's called the, I think that's called the Eisenhower Matrix or something like that named after, named after a strategy that one of your ex-presidents use. But, but yeah, I find that really useful in terms of understanding what to prioritize and actually being able to get what I want to do done.  

Kristin:    00:45:53    Yes, the, the urgent important, I, I use that a lot as well because as human beings, our brain wants to go straight to the path of least resistance to do the easiest thing first when we wanna actually do the opposite. So that is helpful. You can't argue with your own quadrant. And when you're looking at it in black and white, you're like, dammit, I must do the, I must eat the frog. I must do the hardest thing first. <laugh>. Okay. What is one remote work tool that you depend on to run your business?  

James:    00:46:21    Oh, that's a good one. Um, the one that I'd probably struggle the most if I didn't have would be Skype or Evernote, I guess.  

Kristin:    00:46:31    And we're using Skype right now. Things come full circle. I was using Google Hangouts and now we're back on Skype, <laugh> <laugh>. Okay. Do you like working at home or in a coworking space or coffee shop? What is your favorite place to work?  

James:    00:46:44    It depends what I need to get done. If I really wanna knuckle down and concentrate on something, I find coworking spaces great. I, I've not found them as sociable as I thought they would be. That's probably one of the biggest takeaways I found from this whole sort of digital nomad sort of experience over the past few months. I've not found 'em to be particularly sociable, which was a bit of a surprise. Um, coffee shops, I'm not a big fan. I tend to do more sort of planning and strategy if I'm going to a coffee shop because I find the surroundings to be a lot more inspirational. Um, yeah, I find it easier to plan and strategize if I'm sat with a coffee or with a beer or a glass of wine and a notepad or, or, or with Evernote open. So that's typically what I tend to use for that. If I want to be a bit more creative. Home is really good for just working through a lot of, a lot of little stuff that I need reliable internet and no disturbances for. Yeah. So I kind of mix the three I I'm, I'm still not really in a particular fun over whether, uh, whether I'd wanna have a permanent coworking space or just use it by the day or the week as and when I, I feel I can benefit from it. Yeah,  

Kristin:    00:47:56    I do the same thing. I think that's one of the biggest perks of working remotely is that you can use your environment to your advantage. And sometimes that can mean changing workspaces multiple times throughout the week, depending on what activities you're doing or sometimes during the day. And so I completely concur. Uh, what is something that you always have packed in your bag that is not a cell phone or laptop?  

James:    00:48:22    English tea bags. That's the one thing that as an Englishman, that's the one thing that you realize is that every other country in the world, tea is horrible except maybe for Turkey. And yeah, so I always have tea bags wherever I travel.  

Kristin:    00:48:37    Where do you get your tea? Because as I just cleaned out my storage unit, I found all of these boxes of tea from Herod's, because I always go there in the airport on my way out of Heathrow. But What is your favorite brand of tea?  

James:    00:48:49    Um, I drink Yorkshire Tea, it's called, and you can buy it in pretty much in pretty much every supermarket in the uk. And if you're in a big city, you can get it in most sort of expat shops as well, or most food courts of major department stores. I mean, in all over Germany you can get it in, uh, in, in places like <inaudible>, which is like a main department store that most cities have, I also find that, um, you can sometimes find a similar product in, in like Turkish and Asian shops as well. Weirdly, they tend to stock it. But yeah, it's, uh, I, I usually stock up in the UK because it's so much cheaper to buy it  

Kristin:    00:49:28    There. Actually I have that same one as well. I think I have like three different teas from England and one is York Shark tea and it's really good. So I would just drink coffee and tea all day if I could, to be honest. <laugh> <laugh>. Okay. What is one, uh, place that you recommend that everybody check out in Germany, outside of Berlin?  

James:    00:49:48    Outside of the major tourist spots, I would say, um, the Go-to the Moel Valley, it's the most beautiful wine country you could ever imagine. It's the most photogenic space. German wine is really, really underrated. Uh, it's fantastic, especially the white wine. I mean, okay, the reds aren't so good, but German white wine is amazing and the Moel River region is absolutely postcard pretty. I actually cycled the Moel cycle path a few years ago from Mets to, to Colen. It's like 320 kilometers. And it was just one of the most relaxing experiences, even though doing a hundred Ks on a bike each day, I was exhausted. It was just so relaxing, just looking up at the vineyards while you were cycling away. So definitely do that. The other, the other tip for Germany is go to the German ski resorts because they're not so full of poses as Austria and Switzerland and it's a bit more chilled and family orientated and it's pretty good value for money actually, even though people think Germany's expensive, the ski resorts are pretty reasonable.  

Kristin:    00:50:53    Oh, those are great tips. I have never been to the wine country in Germany, although I've been in Spain and Italy and France and um, I'm writing that down <laugh>. That sounds awesome. Riding bikes and drinking wine and vineyards. And I also haven't skied in Germany, so um, maybe that's a good spot to post up for this year. I might be back in Bulgaria or maybe Germany. I was thinking the other day, where should I spend the winter for some more snowboarding? So that's a good recommendation. And we have a, a question from the live chat today. So we're on youtube.com/digital nomad and this is a SDF <laugh>. And he asks, are you a non-tax resident of your home country? So he wrote Australia, but you're actually from the uk so when did you change your tax base away from England?  

James:    00:51:45    So I've not been a tax resident of the UK since 2006. So yeah, when I moved to Germany with a corporate job, I became a tax resident of Germany, which I have been up until the end of last year. Okay.  

Kristin:    00:51:59    And, um, do you think you would ever move back to the uk? Because I always joke around with my clients when they say they just wanna live abroad for like one month or three months or six months. I'm like, okay, well start with one month and then let me know a year from now <laugh> if you wanna go back. 'cause usually that's the first step into a long journey of living abroad.  

James:    00:52:22    Yeah, I, I actually was planning to at the beginning of this year because I, I, I lost my mom, uh, round about this time last year and my, my dad's 80 and not in the best of health, so I, I thought I might have to out of necessity. Um, but I mean, he's, I'm really proud of him actually. He's done amazing in terms of coping on his own. Um, so yeah, unless I had to for reasons of, you know, my, my dad getting to the point that he needed someone, you know, pretty much on, on call to be able to help him out, then I, I, I don't think I would, no, I just, just, the weather and the cost of living I think would drive me crazy.  

Kristin:    00:53:03    Yeah, it's so funny. Like the grass is always greener, but it's good to Yeah, to have roots and, and be able to come and go as you please and when your family needs you. Like that's another big benefit of being able to work from anywhere. And it's something that I've done over the years. Whenever my family needed help with something, I have just basically relocated back here to help them for a few months with whatever it was and then I leave again. So, yeah. Well, thank you so much James. We have also a few offers for people. You can get a free introductory call for anyone looking for advice on how to move to Germany and we'll link to that in the YouTube description and the show notes of the podcast. And then James also has a free coffee break sized guide on moving to Germany, uh, that we'll also link to.  

Kristin:    00:53:55    And he has a YouTube channel called Live Work Germany, that you can just search for that in YouTube and get a lot of great tips and also join both James and I in my Facebook group. Long-term Digital Nomad Success. We're hanging out in there. There's over 2000 people in that group, and it's just like one big happy remote family or aspiring remote family. Um, so James, thanks again for coming on. I hope to see you over in Bulgaria or Serbia or Romania or somewhere, and we'll share a, some skiing and a, and a beer on the slopes. How's that sound? It's  

James:    00:54:34    Been an absolute pleasure, Kristin. Thank you for having me. And yeah, when you're in Europe, then hit me up and we'll spend a day on the slopes together and, uh, and have a vice for you,  

Kristin:    00:54:44    <laugh>. Sounds good. And bye to everybody in the chat. Thank you guys for joining. Thanks for sending us your questions. And if you guys have any more, just leave them in the YouTube comments. I, I see one more over here. Somebody's worried about keeping their driver's license and so I'll just answer that really quickly. If you're European, typically you don't really drive that much, so it's not a big issue. But you can use your driver's license if you're traveling around the world. But if you're relocating somewhere permanently, you can switch it over to that country. You can also get an international driver's permit that will go along with your license just in case your license isn't accepted in the country that you're going to. So I can link to some info on that below as well. So great questions, guys. Keep them coming. See you next week and thank you to everybody.  

Kristin:    00:55:39    I just found out today when I opened this live stream that youtube.com/digitalnomad just reached 300 subscribers, so we're still a new channel. So please subscribe, <laugh>, and, uh, tell all of your friends if you're interested in these topics. And we have Digital Nomad News episode three coming out next week. And also on the same day, we reached 4,000 subscribers on my travel channel Traveling with Kristin. So thank you everybody for the support. Thanks to everybody in my Patreon community and uh, yeah, thank you guys for being listeners and being guests on my show <laugh>, because this is what it's all about, just sharing the wealth, sharing information, and collaborating with each other. So with that Ciao for now, bye James. And we will see you guys next week at youtube.com/DigitalNomad. Bye bye. Thanks for listening. Remember to leave a review and share this episode with someone in your network. And if you want more tips and advice on working remotely, make sure to sign up for my insider list TravelingwithKristin.com/subscribe, where you can find links to download free resources like My Digital Nomad Starter guide. Of course, also subscribe to youtube.com/digitalnomad so you don't miss any of our weekly videos, Digital Nomad News or Live Streams. See you there.